speakoutarchive 16 10/01/02-02/19/03

startdate 20030219
archive XVI

the Project for the New American Century....do a search on it!
Two years ago a project set up by the men who now surround George W Bush said what America needed was "a new Pearl Harbor". Its published aims have,alarmingly, come true.
What was needed for America to dominate (the world), it said, was "some catastrophicand catalysing event - like a new Pearl Harbor". The attacks of 11 September 2001 provided the "new Pearl Harbor", described as "the opportunity of ages". The extremists who have since exploited 11 September come from the era of Ronald Reagan, when far-right groups and "think-tanks" were established to avenge the American "defeat" in Vietnam.
Richard Perle is one of the founders of the Project for the New American Century, (the PNAC.) Other founders include Dick Cheney, now vice-president, Donald Rumsfeld, defence secretary, Paul Wolfowitz, deputy defence secretary, I Lewis Libby, Cheney's chief of staff, William J Bennett, and others you see frequenting the Pentagon and the airwaves.
Two years ago it recommended an increase in arms-spending by $48bn so that Washington could "fight and win multiple, simultaneous major theatre wars". This has happened.
It said the United States should develop "bunker-buster" nuclear weapons and make "star wars" a national priority. This is happening. It said that, in the event of Bush taking power, Iraq should be a target. And so it is.
As for Iraq's alleged "weapons of mass destruction", these were dismissed, in so many words, as a convenient excuse, which it is.
Time and again, 11 September is described as an "opportunity". In last April's New Yorker, Condoleezza Rice was noted to have called together senior members of the National Security Council and asked them "to think about 'how do you capitalise on these opportunities'", which she compared with those of "1945 to 1947": the start of the cold war.
Since 11 September, America has established bases at the gateways to all the major sources of fossil fuels, especially central Asia. The Unocal oil company is to build a pipeline across Afghanistan. Bush has scrapped the Kyoto Protocol on greenhouse gas emissions, the war crimes provisions of the International Criminal Court and the anti-ballistic missile treaty. He has said he will use nuclear weapons against non-nuclear states "if necessary".
Under cover of propaganda about Iraq's alleged weapons of mass destruction, the Bush regime is developing new weapons of mass destruction that undermine international treaties on biological and chemical warfare. According to a classified document prepared for Rumsfeld, the new organisation, known by its Orwellian moniker as the Proactive Pre-emptive Operations Group, or P2OG, will provoke terrorist attacks which would then require "counter-attack" by the United States on countries "harbouring the terrorists".
In other words, innocent people will be killed by the United States.
This is reminiscent of Operation Northwoods, the plan put to President Kennedy by his military chiefs for a phoney terrorist campaign - complete with bombings, hijackings, plane crashes and dead Americans - as justification for an invasion of Cuba.
Kennedy rejected it.
He was assassinated a few months later.
Now Rumsfeld has resurrected Northwoods, but with resources undreamt of in 1963 and with no global rival to invite caution. "Our position" is code for lying. Remember Rumsfeld's "Office of Misinformation" that he spoke about in Pentagon briefings last year? Official lying is more pervasive today. We may laugh at Tony Blair's "Iraq dossier" and Jack Straw's inept lie that Iraq has developed a nuclear bomb (which his minions rushed to "explain"). But the more insidious lies, justifying an unprovoked attack on Iraq and linking it to would-be terrorists who are said to lurk in every subway station, are routinely channelled as news.
They are not news; they are black propaganda.
This corruption makes journalists and broadcasters mere ventriloquists' dummies. An attack on a nation of 22 million suffering people is discussed by commentators as if it were a subject at an academic seminar. The issue for these humanitarians is not primarily the brutality of modern imperial domination, but how "bad" Saddam Hussein is. There is no admission that their decision to join the war party further seals the fate of perhaps thousands of innocent Iraqis condemned to wait on America's international death row. Their doublethink will not work. You cannot support murderous piracy in the name of humanitarianism. ~(thanks to Norm Dixon and Chris Floyd)
human <human@thestart.org>
amerikkka -

FINALLY, somebody says something with actual content. I've been waiting for that the whole time, and now you have earned my respect. As for the whole weapons of mass destruction thing, the whole reason N. Korea is arming is because of us. I read in the paper a commentary on how the UN has 2 different stances, and how they should keep the same stance. I say bullshit. With N. Korea, that whole mess was caused by Bush walking out of the Kyoto agreement. However, Iraq has been disregarding the UN for years, and that's why the US should listen to the UN and take on Iraq as a unified coalition. If they don't, they're no better than Iraq, because we will be disregarding the UN as well. We're asking Iraq to disarm, despite the fact that we've threatened them with invasion. It's bullshit. That's like me saying, put down the bat you're holding, or I'll hit you with my bat, all the while knowing that even if you put your bat down, I'll probably still hit you . That goes for both Irsq, and N. Korea. So I can see why they are reacting the way that they're reacting. That's all because of that moron for a president that we have. Bush is a fucking menace, and he needs to go. My biggest problem with him is that he runs from his problems. The reason I say find Osama is that he promised the nation he would find him, and somehow now Saddam is the big problem. He still hasn't found Osama, the public knows this, so now he's trying to move on to something else so we can forget this failure. And the economy, what about it. You can't just throw tax cuts at it, and make it go away. Doesn't happen that way. First they need to come up with a comprehensive budget that they should follow like it was the bible (you know how religious politicians are). Then they need to make sure that they get enough money to surpass their spending. I don't see increasing spending while decreasing the influx of money into the government (tax cuts) working. Then they need to make sure that even if they overspend the budget (like they always do), they still have enough money to cover it. But they have to address the issue first. Yoiu know that during the elections last year, the white house told the Republican candidates to use the war on terror in their elections to distract the voters from the shitty economy. I don't want leaders that distract us. I want leaders that tackle our problems head on, and try to find a solution. Bush is not this type of leader. Now, does anyone have anything constructive to say in response to this?
marionette
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mario, i liked you so much in the beginning. it was cool to have somebody with a different opinion contributing to the whole discussion. little did i know that you weren't interested in having a discussion, you just wanted to give your idea and wait for somebody else to give a different one or agree with yours. there's been lots of ideas, thoughts, opinions and tons of questions from all over and that's a good thing. you said you'd like to hear some solutions and i told you to pay attention. sorry if all the sarcasm offended you but, no, you're not right. my solution? given that i've spent zero time as a real political analyst it would be pretty difficult to come up with any solution that doesn't have as many holes in it as yours does. and i suppose that no solutions have ever been reached by talking first? oh no, everybody is talking! they're not coming out of the woodwork with ideas like "call in a favor" or "find osama," like he's in a fucking where's waldo book. no, let's not start talking now. it's better to start more shit. who has weapons of mass destruction? you seem to know about nato and if carpet bombing is "in" anymore so give me a grocery list of who's got the big bombs. include which countries have used them and how many people they've killed with them. maybe then we'll really know who's the biggest threat. all you need is a grudge and an army to be in the axis of evil and with that criteria our country is kinda high on the list. that's right, our country, the one that, according to you, "had enough balls to pave the way for every other country to gain it's freedom" and "doesn't commit political assassination with it's own men." you agree that bush shouldn't be president but you don't seem to see anything awry with us having weapons of mass destruction. a homeland disarmament and regime change, that was a suggested solution but it did come with a helping of questions because it's "easier said than down." if you think i'm an anarchist with a taste for conspiracy theories you're only a few degrees off. you mentioned looking for the lesser of two evils, i'm a big fan of pros and cons and try to look at all sides of the situation. we need a dialogue with all of us and our varying opinions represented in order to sort through the ideas that make the most sense. we need to communicate with eachother so we don't start trying to talk with our muscle power. we take a look at the real problem to see why it happened and if it should/will happen again. that's the best solution.
~pukegyang~
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i think that the start is fucken bad ass. i love the cd and cant wait to see them.
stephanie <s0913@msn.com>
la, ca usa -

war = bad. anything that involves a lot of people dying can't be good. love = good. granted that isn't all it takes to solve problems. neither is arguing. i love theSTART. i'm here for the music... ~ruby
ruby <r10t_grrl@hotmail.com>
San Diego, CA USA -

Everybody has seemed to forget that I am agaisnt THIS war. I said take out Saddam, LATER. And where did the patriot thing come from. I don't ever recall questioning other countries' patriotism.
marionette
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Taking shots at me doesn't make me any less right about one thing, you still HAVEN'T provided your own solution. You've missed my point. Don't just talk, solve. I'm still waiting.......
marionette
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i really love hwp and now i love theStart too, but am i ever gonna get to see you guys live? please play in england sometime, you have fans here too!!!
pinkuiro <loves_young_nightmare@hotmail.com>
Farnham, England -

the blizzard of 2003 has left me snowed in, so i was skimming through theprp.com. i saw something about the used playing with co+ca and theSTART. which would be just dandy cept the only NY date was way way way upstate. man i dont care who you guys tour with, just get back over here!
natalie
ny -

you know that things have turned from bad to ugly when jam master jay gets shot in the face and they sell his name out to dr pepper.
kt
-

Hey, have the tribute cd's been sent out yet? I found the post Mia left a while back saying they'd be mailed at the end of December, which would explain how I missed mine since I wasn't at my mailing address then. I sent Mia an email a while back asking if they'd been sent out yet, but she must have missed it. Anyways, just checking if anyone knew what was going on. On a different note, is the Start going to make it back to Texas anytime soon?
kroze
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it's a regular bullshit parade in these parts.
look, buddy, not everyone can write a punk rock new wave pop song about ice cream. 'nuff said.
in regards to the new "puppet" posts i think you're missing the goddamn point. "pull the plug on the system" could sound the way you took it or it could mean the system we have for deciding who to go to war with and why. the "system" is also our foreign policies. i'd like you to point out the part where i said capitalism won't work and we should all be communists now. and i'm sure you'd like to dispute reputable historic sources and counter them with your own account of why the second bomb was dropped when it was, since you seem to be such the history buff. you want a solution to our problems? i really like yours, by the way, i'm sure you're also an expert on covert military tactics and your plan to take out saddam is genius. they probably fired you from the pentagon for being too forward thinking for them. it's funny how all these people are arming themselves and there must not be a single reason why. who could hate us for any reason? according to you we're the only true patriots on the globe, everybody takes notes from us. why isn't everybody in the middle east kissing our ass for being so damn cool instead of coming over here to kill us? talk is cheap but at least speech writers make a living. maybe if you paid more attention while people were talking you'd have more friends and wouldn't have so much time on your hands to plot saddam's secret assassination.
~pukeocchio~
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I think it's funny how I throw out a challenge, and know will step up to the plate. I've already said what needs to be done, and Irq is at the bottom of the list. If you wan an alternative to war, and the weapons inspections aren't working, then I say it's time to call in a favor. The U.S. does not commit political assination with it's own men. This true. However, it has been suggested (and I wouldn't doubt it) that they use another country to do it for them. You see, it is illegal for the U.S. to commit these murders under it's laws. But you cannot prosecute someone who is not of this country, and commits the act overseas. My suggestion, call in a favor, and secretly take out Sddam. Easier said than down I know, but if you don't want war, but would like Saddam taken out, this is my idea.
marionette
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I understand that the name is a puppet, but it was inspired by a Tsunami Bomb song. Docile sheep, hardly. I do my talking at the ballot box, like everyone else should i a democratic society. France took it's cue from the Americans. They had their revolution after the Americans. Like I said, I have yet to hear a solution from any of you. Well..................
marionette
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i believe i've seen a "there is no such thing as new wave" shirt somewhere. <3
pokazhi
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the START do not try to be "insert label here" or call themselves "insert label here". they are what they are. you get it or you don't. they tour with who invites them on tour. They have toured with so many different "types" of bands. Do you think weezer sounds like AFI. there is no such thing as new wave.
catholic discipline
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first of all, i don't remember thestart calling themselves new wave punkish whatever. everyone else seems to be calling them that. and second, i dont think that the term "emo" even means anything. indie bands just got slapped with the term "emo" like at the drive in, they're called "emo". or rather should i say sparta. just because bands don't fit a certain "genre" they're now called "emo", which is complete and utter bullshit. so really, an indie style of music is now "emo". great. labeling someone or something is so grade school. and thats where it should stay.
pokazhi
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but i think we've tried just about all the things there are to try... iiiii dunno. i dont like war either but sometimes i think its the only choice.
TAP <colleen@fkrock.com>
Mechanicsburg, PA USA -

Does it matter who they tour with? I wouldn't expect a support band to sound like the headlining one. The fact that they're out on the road is the important thing.
bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
dublin, ireland -

Can someone explain this to me please...are the sart trying to be more like an emo rock band now or something? i thought they were always saying they were nu wavey punk or whatever? i am confused becaue i heard a rumor they are touring with some emo bands soon like the used ..who SUCK even though i love the other bands listed on that tour. i just thinks its a bit bizarre that's all.
sinerfella
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I'm sure Ireland loved being a part of the British Empire. Oh wait, they didn't.
Ehm, yes, that's true. It was called the 1916 rising. What's your point? "But Americans had enough balls to do something about it, and pave the way for every other country to get it's freedom"
The Irish revolution WAS inspired by the American and the French revolutions, no doubt about it. If you want to pat your stars and stripes back about it, remember that the French revolution was the first revolution. Vive le France, etc.
Bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
dublin, ireland -

The show was BRILLIANT! One of the best I've ever seen. Love you guys.
Ellen
ca -

yeah it is the same thing but i guess i'd tend to follow the line of thought a little farther and wonder how to fix the problem from the bottom up---and not with bombs from the top down.
kt
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kt - yes, but isnt that the same thing here?? after the treaty of versailles german began to rearm under hitler, and NO ONE stopped them. then they tried to take over the world. now the world is allowing iraq to rearm... what do you think he's gonna do with all those weapons???
TAP <colleen@fkrock.com>
Mechanicsburg, PA 17055 -

i mean really, now. we'll all go ahead and talk, marionette. you can be the docile sheep with all the rest of them. baaah.
kt
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the fact that you call yourself a puppet says a lot to back up your limp dick attitude.
kt
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Talk, talk talk. That's all I see. Oh, and about the atomic bombs, it's a thing called the lesser of two evils. There was plan A: Invade Japan, when the emperor said that the japanese would fight to the last man, thereby risking miilions, not thousands, millions of japanese and american lives, or B: detonate a bomb so powerful, it would scare an entire country into submission. Lesser of 2 evils. And get your facts straight about the second bomb before spewing off you theories. The second bomb was sort of a reminder to the emperor because he still wouldn't surrender. Now, what do you suppose about the government? Mutiny, a coup, what. You want to overthrow the government, is that it? And replace it with what? Communcism, facism, a monarchy. All talk. And democracy is corrupt huh? I'm sure Ireland loved being a part of the British Empire. Oh wait, they didn't. But Americans had enough balls to do something about it, and pave the way for every other country to get it's freedom. It's not that I'm very proud of our president and our lawmakers, but spewing out your hate without some insightfulness, or answers on what to do to fix it is pointless. Talk is cheap gentlemen.
marionette
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no more rain tonight hopefully...
Emily
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Can't wait to see thestart tonight and all of you beautiful people!
ellen
ca -

There were almost 2 million people at the Stop the War demonstration today in London. Doesn't that rock.
Fiona
London, -

everyone dislikes bush, but what does everyone think of tony blair? doesn't he want to go to war with iraq as bad as bush? no one seems to be mentioning hiiim
punchy
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Yeah ! what he said.
an earthling
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blow chunks, not brains.

the country is split in half. the voting public, recounts aside, only partially agrees that bush should even be considered president. the republicans were hoping that americans would finally recognize bush as their president but current polls show that we're still 50/50%. they're trying to start a war with only half the american people behind the current commander in chief. if we have another attack or if the american public wholly doubts bush and his intentions we could be sent into some kind of chaotic governmental mis-management ordeal. we'd be even more weakened. the saying is "united we stand" and no matter how many flags we hang by our front door the nation is still divided. not all of us are confident in our leader and the government is starting to become more and more visibly covert. with all this new homeland security, designed to "help us" and "protect us" by spying on us every second in our home and on the street, the powers that be are publically telling everyone that they're sharing less information with us and being more cryptic in their methods. it obviously doesn't matter if we agree with the war or not, we can't even agree on who's in office, they can make the call and send out the troops tomorrow and all we'll do is hear about it on the news the next day. is it a mutiny we're after? do we need a regime change on our own soil? did we have to go to orange before we finally pull the plug on the system? or can we rally together enough to pacify whatever lusts reside within the war makers? bronagh is 100% correct. america is the only country to level a couple major cities with weapons of mass destruction. that makes us some evil fucking bastards according to our current supposed standards regarding tactics of war and terrorism. how can anybody trust us? aug 9, 1945, three days after we bombed hiroshima and got our point accross to the emperor of japan we decided to test out the second bomb anyway and kill a few more million people in nagasaki. it's fucking true, kids. we killed millions of people for the sake of a science experiment, just to see what the other bomb that we made could do. where's that in your american history books in your public schools? have any other countries, no matter how immoral we might consider their customs, done anything as fucked up as that as recently as that? and now we're self proclaimed police officers, dictating who gets to keep what kind of bombs in their armies. what kind of measures do we need to take to get our point accross? how do we force out dipshit and let the people in office know that we won't tolerate this fucking war? how do we get a homeland regime change and disarmament? we need to decide if we're pissed off or just slightly irked and if we're willing to do something serious or just go through the motions. do we rise up or lay down?
~zoot puke~
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from what i read the way the votes were re-counted they actually threw out a lot of what would have been considered legitimate votes for al gore. if properly re-counted al gore would have won by nearly 3,000 votes i believe. as for the threat of iraq, i have trouble believing they'd be so eager to blast us all to hell if we weren't so hot to blast THEM to hell. there's a reason americans are so hated across the globe, and the way our country is going about this war thing proves it a million times over.
stefanie
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And another thing...I don't think the American people DID vote Bush in. Forget about democracy. Democracy is corrupt.
Bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
dublin, ireland -

The American government want to attack Iraq because they believe Iraq have weapons of mass destruction, despite what INSPECTORS have said. However, it seems perfectly fine for America to have those weapons. Hmm...makes NO sense to me.
Bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
dublin, ireland -

Yeah, he did get in on a technicality, so let's make the opposition so overwhelming, that there is absolutely no way for him to win the presidency in court again.
marionette
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CAN we really vote the DUMBASS out? I didn't realize we voted him IN.
an earthling
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TAP---we did not just "let" germany build into the nazi monstrosity that it was after the Treaty. that Treaty is what CAUSED the nazi's to come about. that TREATY was meant to punish the germans after WWI, creating horrendous economic conditions in germany that made our great depression look like a high ride. anything can happen in a situation like that. people are desperate, and will follow any message. like hitler's. like bin laden's. like kim jon il's.
kt
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You know what, your right. Bush is a menace. However, in a democratic society such as ours, when can just vote the dumbass out. Iraq doesn't have that option. And for the safety of our interests (troops, oil, allies, whatever), he should be taken out. Also, carpet bombing is no longer an effective tool whenever laser guided smart bombs are so much better. Anyway, Iraq is a threat to Syria, which I believe is a part of NATO. Under theguidelines of NATO, an attack on one ally is considered an attack on the entire organization. This was done to prevent another "Germany". You are much less likely to attack a country when it has many more behind it waiting to counter strike. But yet, Syria remains in danger. But like I said, Iraq can wait. I just read that N. Korea's missles have that can reach U.S. soil. Yet we continue to mess around with Iraq. Like I said, Saddam needs to go, but only after we finish off some other things first.
marionette
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but Iraq is violating the armistice that they signed at the end of the Gulf War by producing weapons of mass destruction. doesnt anybody remember what happened when we let Germany violate the Treaty of Versailles after World War I?????
TAP <colleen@fkrock.com>
Mechanicsburg, PA USA -

yeah, on one hand it would be nice to not inhale any sort of chemicals iraq intends to spread, but do you think by bush acting the way he is, will save us from chemical warfare?
?
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um...
a counter point is a debate term. it basically means that you give the other side of the coin a rest and explain things in a more opposite perspective. we do have the right to say whatever we feel but sometimes we don't want to speak up when we know our opinion is in the minority. the best thing to do is to have a discussion with all sides of the argument represented.
since all this bullshit started i've heard basically two different opinions: blow their countries to shit or leave them alone. are these our only two options? for everybody that says killing is wrong no matter what, are you saying you'd rather die in an act of terrorism than defend yourself? i refuse to go to war but i also refuse to die because i didn't think things through enough. so what if we call this whole thing off and don't bomb anybody and just go about our lives? do we figure that we're totally safe or do we start preparing for another terrorist attack? should we just figure that whatever happens will happen and if our lungs melt and skin bubbles from chemical fallout that's just what we get for being capitalist shit balls? america is a fucken young country, most countries have had five times as many civil wars and the like. we barely know what to decide to do with our own lives let alone deciding how long we'll let other people keep living, or living the way that they do. so we should just hang out here in our little continent and say "hi" to all the other countries at the olympics but otherwise just mind our own business, right? like we don't already dictate what goes on in other places around the world and no one's economy relies on our own for anything? we've got our hands and fingers into everything that goes on in every major city on the map. we're babies compared to all these other countries and we boss everybody around. why do you think they're so pissed off at us over there?
when you're hunting ducks flying overhead if you aim for the lead duck at the tip of the "v" formation and take him out all the other ducks scatter. imagine the global economy and then take america out of the picture. way different, huh? and in a new picture like that don't you think that the bully who took america out would get a little more respect? howabout when that bully is one of the oldest races and creeds in the history of the world? i'd like to believe that iraq would just chill the fuck out if we say that we're not gonna go to war with them. that's not gonna happen. you're all familiar with the middle east law making policies like chopping off the hand of someone who'd been caught stealing. say what you want about america's injustice and the death penalty and all that and then compare it to what goes on over there. sure, we're sooooooo wrong about saddam and how those guys feel about all of us. right. we'd hafta do much more than just call off our war dogs or send over bags of rice to al queda, we'd need to change our foreign policies and stop pissing people off. but the president isn't about to say that we're in the wrong, he'd rather drag us through his faux patriotic bullshit crusade. greed and racism are a powerful mix and have carved out the history of myriads of countries led by crazed warlords. what's the alternative? we can't just fly over there and feed all their hungry people, slip them business cards that say "u.s.a. is okay!" and have them decide that their leader is wrong about us.
we've got lots of problems, people, and i don't see many of you with solutions. there's lots of finger pointing and if we find out that somebody has a different opinion we do a shitload more finger pointing to try and prove them wrong. does anybody care about finding a solution? does anybody care about getting a positive dialogue of various opinions going so we can constructively decide how to improve our situation?

"abortions for all!" boo! "okay... no abortions for anyone!" boo! "okay... abortions for some, miniature american flags for others!" YAY! ~ kodos (as bob dole), the simpsons
~pukeive resistance~
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how about "i was a teenage gulf war" or "the gulf war returns" ...?
stefanie
philly, -

I really hate the fact that people are saying "Oh war is good for us! America will be safe!!!" My mother, who when I was younger, taught me to respect all living things, no matter if their president or supervisor was an ass, still treat the person like I would anyone else. Now this woman, she believes bush. She says he isn't going to war for the oil, or for the bragging rights of saying he saved america. She says he has our, the americans, best interest at heart. I mean, she literally believes this. And so do a lot of americans, and it's saddening how they think that war will bring peace. You go and bomb someone's home. There will be repercussions... People who live here, who have their families to worry about, will be upset, and they will do things, no matter how small, to hurt people. It's already happening in a small town 20 minutes from where I live. Two men, who are upset that bush wants to go to war with their home, where they came from, where they were born and some of their family still lives... they were upset and decided to go out with their rifles and started shooting in the air. A small boy, no more than 3 years old, was playing in his front lawn. A bullet came down and wounded him in the chest. That is the kind of stuff that happens with war. Now you can't tell me WAR IS GOOD and that YOU SHOULD SUPPORT WAR. I'm sure you think "america will be safer!!", but rest assured, bush will still be bombing anywhere he can to get what he wants. And who is going to protect the innocent people not only in the U.S., but all over the rest of the world? The people who think it's wrong that war is happening? No one, but ourselves. We have to fend for ourselves and deal with this, even though we think it's wrong, we still have to live here for the time being because some of us can't just get up and go live somewhere else. We just have to "deal."
pokazhi
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and besides, people, GULF WAR II just sounds stupid anyway.
kt
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No War of any kind should be supported. Young people killing other young people for old rich folk is not something to support. carpet bombing innocent humans is not something to support. slaughtering a nation of people is going to make us safe ? HA! And if what they say about this man in power in Iraq is in fact true, what business of the American gov't is it to "take him out". there is obviously an ulterior motive. think people. don't buy what they sell you. do your homework on this one. It's wrong. killing is always wrong. control of the public mind by those in power. this is what is going on. constant fear keeps you immobile, docile. find your power and take it back. now.
an earthling
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Saddam's a threat to the world!? What about George Bush? He only wants a war to get his hands on oil. This whole thing is about capitalist GREED. A war would be one big act of terrorism on the Iraqi people, or are Americans the only ones who can be terrorised now?! If you thought there was a direct threat to American people, you would NOT want this war. So what about the Iraqis? Don't they count too?
Bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
Dublin, Ireland -

I support a war with Iraq, only not now. Obviously, Saddam's a menace to the world, and should be taken out, but right now there are more pressing issues. Fix the economy. That's the biggest issue. A stronger, unified nation makes for a sre victory according to Sun Tzu, only he said it much better. Unfortunately for all those people that love getting money back, tht means do away with the tax cuts. The government is already spending more money than it receives, and now it wants to spend even more, while earning less. It makes no sense. Also, the only real argument you could make for was is the gas prices. The prices are sky rocketing, and the longer Bush holds out, the higher they will go. I'm not really old enough to fully understand this, but I read that high oil prices usually leads to a recession. That's a word that will make anyone shake just a little. But nyway, fix the damn economy. Then find Osama Bin Laden. Remember him? He's like Crystal Pepsi, here one minute, gone the next. Then there's N. Korea. Iraq is suspected of having weapons of mss destruction, but they cannot be found, and that's grounds for war. However, N. Korea is KNOWN to be building nuclear weapons, and nobody does a damn thing about it. Do those 3 things first, then worry about Iraq.
marionette
-

holy crap. no one's gunned this guy down yet?

just curious and not looking for an argument, we've had all this one sided anti government babble flying around these parts for quite some time, is anybody willing to give a counter point? does anybody agree with this war on terror or think that "homeland security" is a good idea?
~george w. barf~
-

ha ha HA! YESSS! everybody go to that website. EVERYBODY. alex jones always has such wonderful little tidbits for us. also try www.prisonplanet.com for more. prisonplanet has all the information like that which stef has pointed out archived into sections that are really easy to read.
kt
-

http://www.infowars.com/patriotact2.htm EVERYBODY READ THIS.
stefanie
philadelphia, -

I love the start
Matt White <illnino2002@yahoo.com>
Columbia, TN usa -

Or as others would say, Hi. Very strange way of saying things, wouldn't you say. What can I say, I'm not all there. Work's the main reason for this. Now I'm just babbling.
marionette <sweetest_perfection620@yahoo.com>
San Antonio, Tx -

"I am Jack's wasted life."
marionette <sweetest_perfection@yahoo.com>
San Antonio, Tx United States -

went to see AFI last night, and wow. so. fucking. good. saw gwen stefani hnaging out too.

i'm going to try my hardest to make it to the troubadour gig next weekend. i'm in LA but am at a party for some of the night. as it;s one of the few times i get to see my girlfriend i'm having a tough time fitting it all in, but we'll see. nothing would make me happier than seeing thestart play again so soon.
kenickie
-

hey all.... love theSTART and have to admit that i am also a Human Waste Project fan.... love Aimee.... she is a goddess.... Rock on ;P
Velvet_Concubine <Alauras_fire@hotmail.com>
Hellville, -

does anyone know what time theSTART goes on at the pomonoa show?
(katie) <iscellardoor@yahoo.com>
-

I think the HB show starts at 3:45 and theSTART goes on at 4:45. Don't hold me to this though, I'm not totally sure. Check out theSTART's other website's (www.thisisthestart.com) bulletin board, I think they were talking about it there.
Sean
CO -

well I found it! never mind...yeah I feel dumb......duh..it would be under lyrics! well anywho....hi again! :) *****************************************************
*jen*
-

hey whats up everyone..Im new to this thing....I love theSTART my boyfriend got me into them and we saw them live in august I think and they put on a major kick ass show. I hope they come back. uh...question can anyone be nice enough to kindly direct me to a place for the lyrics to "trinity" off the new ep because Im thinking of singing it in the school talent show and in my opinion get ppl to hear the music. any help thanx! *****************
*jen* <thestargirl2020@yahoo.com>
san antonio, tx usa -

Punchy + Sean! ooh God, if theSTART + le tigre went on tour together i'd die of happiness. :hint hint guys: I found about it the day before it was happening. it was all ages + free. and Kathleen got on stage and did karaoke to theCLASH to top it all off. it was great! i'll warn you ahead of time if she does it again!
natalie
ny -

No way! Kathleen Hanna is awesome. Huge fan of Bikini Kill and Le Tigre. Hope those ladies go back out on tour again soon... Hey, wouldn't that be a tour, Le Tigre and theSTART?
Sean
CO -

You guys kick ass
Negasonic teenage warhead <asdf174@prodigy.net>
Kansas City, MO 64109 -

natalie. that is not fair. i would have loved to go to kathleen hanna's kareoke part :( ITS NOT FAIR.
punchy
-

You guys totally kick ass...I love ya and I can't wait for the concert on the 15th!!!
Heather <nodoubtnicegrl143@hotmail.com>
Whittier, CA USA -

can somebody please find out more information about this saturday show. I don't wanna get lost and miss it, when I go to huntington...thanks!!!!!
emily
-

No friggin' way. Deftones opening for LINKIN PARK?!!? What the shit is that. Metallica, Deftones and Linkin Park. That makes absolutely no sense. I'm curious to hear the new Deftones work. They say an album should be out in June..? Hmm.
Stephanie <madetoburn@hotmail.com>
Sammamish, WA -

I have no idea how I got here but I like what I see and hear and give the props where they are diserved and "THE START" deserves giant props, keep rockin! and now that I'm a fan ill see you at the next show!
RICK <boburs1@yahoo.com>
Lost Angeles , CA -

what time does the start play in huntigton beach pier.
nick <nickparada@yahoo,com>
la, ca usa -

i dont know how many of you are fans of bikini kill or le tigre, but last night in NYC Kathleen Hanna hosted a karaoke night at a bar. It was the single most awesome thing (aside from a start show) that i have ever attended.
natalie
-

Aaaww wow someone loves me LOL...
Lorie <diablopixie@aol.com>
West Los Angeles, CA -

hey, does anyone know what time the free show starts at on friday?
Jen
San Diego, CA -

your shitting me. the deftones are opening that monstrosity? im totally out of the loop as far as that band goes. they are amazing, have always been one of my favorites but after chino went to the hospital like a year and a half ago because his throat was all falling apart that was the last i had ever heard of them.
kt
-

does anyone else find it profoundly disturbing that that the deftones are the opening band on the linkin park tour? also, i miss thestart dearly. that is all.
mike <trashboyx@yahoo.com>
-

I'm s0o0o0o0o excited for the show. I can't wait to see my <3 Lorie <3 and all the rest of the O.G heretics. Yaaaaay!
Miss Linds <raz0rlici0us@yahoo.com>
Burbank, CA -

Hey, waz up... i'm a big START fan!!! Come back to TX!
Hallie Cochran <halliecochran@hotmail.com>
Huntsville, Tx USA -

hey guys. first off i just want to say i really like the changes made to thisisthestart.com. it came out really great.
k. i figured you guys would be good to ask. my friend wants to move to california, but hes not sure what part to go to. and how expensive it is and all that. i probably wouldn't care but he wants to bring me with him. i think he wants to be near LA. ANY and all suggestions will be much appreciated.
thanks
natalie <nirvanavcv@aol.com>
ny -

wait i just read my post and discovered i think backwards. i just got back from california and i still don't know how tme zones work? genius. maybe the times.. should alternate.
stefanie
-

yeah, ignore me. i'm shit. ; )
kenickie
-

Yes it would. we're 8hrs ahead...
Fiona
London, -

wouldn't it be 9pm in england if its 1pm in los angeles?
m
-

no, 1pm pst makes it 4pm on the east coast and 6pm in britain, sounds perfect.
kenickie
-

if it was done at 1pm pst it would be 4pm est. i hope this clears up your confusion.
carrie
USA -

LOL puke does whether or not anything i say is true matter? would you rather i not say them at all?
kt
-

oh yeah this is really cute: http://www.truthout.com/docs_02/020103B.blx.us.misqtng.htm
stefanie
-

you do it 1pm pst on a weekend and all us east coasters (and especially the europeans) are going to have to roll out of bed all EARLY. i think an evening thing would be nice. the fact that there's so many people all over the world makes it tough.
stefanie
-

are the things that you say really true, kt, or do you help flood the masses with disinformation like some undercover federal agent? zombie kissers? raining astronaut appendages? bodycount are in the studio?

has anybody taken time zones into account yet? i say weekends, one pm pst.
~vomituptuous~
-

Hi, Just wanted to shout at Aimee....Hey this your devoted fans in AZ, The ones who drove to L.A. to see your first show @ The dragonfly, We just wanna say you've got our support, we're always telling our Record stores to stock your CDs, and if they don't that's their loss... Well I wasn't able to make it to your last show out here, but I can't wait to see you guys again!!@ Best wishes to all. Melissa and Co.
meLissa <missy_lux@hotmail.com>
phoeNix, aZ thE statEs -

I sent an e-mail yesterday to the doof about the compilation thing... As for the chat I say we should do them in the evening anyday it's onnnnn LOL... Oh yes thanks for the good time tonite yup...
Lorie <DiabloPixie@AOL.COM>
West Los Angeles, CA -

sent out an e-mail for the warped tour cd.. will send more! chat sessions.. i think weekends would be best.. pizza party was great tonite! :)
jean (number 2 apparently) lol <defgurl1@aol.com>
los angeles, -

a tuesday or thursday around....10pm or after....
-erika
-

so its the weather here has been weird again lately and its been raining space shuttle parts all weeked. my roomate's friend and his brother were hospitalized yesterday in waco when a chunk of an exhuast coupling fell in their front yard and they touched it. not too far from there, a leg fell in somebody's back patio area.
kt
-

i vote for sunday nights! wow. someone else from PA?? *gasp* rock on
TAP <oneireland@yahoo.com>
Mechanicsburg, PA USA -

any time i guess. we have gigs on a lot of weekends, but like i say, any time.
kenickie
-

Almost Famous! Yea I am up for a week chat session.
megziE
-

you know i hope this Columbia shit motivates the notion of a new space-fervor. so they can finally replace that piece of shit spaceshuttle before that happens to all of them
kt
-

im liking some time on either friday or saturday. or even sunday.
punchy
-

any times good for me
kt
-

hey guys sorry i got confused on the last comment i made i thought it would be like a profile thing. yeah im new to the Speak bored but im glad i finally joined it im lindsay by the way.
lindsay <rubysoho212@yahoo.com>
allentown, pa -

i dig music
lindsay <rubysoho212@yahoo.com>
allentown, PA usa -

taking votes for a weekly chat meeting... what do you think would be the best day and time for everyone to meet in the START chat room?
echo
-

aimeeee <3
callen slut. <xxxpunkhorexxx@aol.com>
springfield, mo us. -

so i take it theSTART are doing warped this year? score.
punchy
-

except i put it in the wrong field. *sigh*
kenickie
-

hey malcolm, it just occurred to me...my MSN messenger is so screwy it doesn't work now. if you've got AIM my screen-name is alarchunig. that goes for anyone else who wants to add me too. :)

still waiting for this to be coloured and properly lettered, but click on my name for a one page strip i did for a comics website.
kenickie <http://www.angelfire.com/me3/kenickie/cm1.html>
-

Priority=URGENT !Heretics alert! Its time to START this years Warped Compilation CD- featuring new and upcoming bands as well as established bands from the Warped Tour line-up! Shoot them an email and let them know you would like to see theSTART on the comp! Heretics! Please email this week & beyond..... Lets get theSTART on this record! SEND YOUR email to dummy@sideonedummy.com and let them know you'd like to see theSTART on the new warped tour 2003 compilation CD. thanks you rule me. ~human
human <human@thestart.org>
-

1. Save Ferris(RIP) 2.theSTART 3.Pretty Girls Make Graves 4.Radiohead 5. At The Drive In
AngoE**
-

top 5 favorite bands? 1. the start 2. jimmy eat world 3. 7th standard 4. all american rejects 5. foo fighters
linkinpork
-

Thanks for the Birthday Wishes laura!!!!!

:)
Amy <wirefrog@aol.com>
-

holeeeeeeee SHIT my friends, guess who's back in the studio--- BODYCOUNT!!!!!!!!!!!!
kt
-

wow!!! new site is looks groovy.
emily
-

I really like this new layout. Gonna try to convince Mom to roadtrip out to CA for at least one show. I need a fix baaaadly!!!
megziE
-

ahhhh. sorry for the double post.
hyp
-

got a few of those too. a lot of them now are "RE: (whatever their subject is) there's something going on with malcolm's start mailing list thingy too the past little while.
and yes valentine you spelt it right.
hypnaughtika
-

i actually got an eMail from hypnaughtika (sorry if i dont spell name right, half awake/sleep,its 2am) and i didnt open it because it had "subj:alsdjlsadj" and then 2 more from here that said "subj:cbgb pictures i took" and then another "subj:kajshdkhad" and then i started getting them from maise, and the from srpukealot and then just more recently, human. so, yeah, someone has been infected with the virus, back in... i think it was september of last year. and then its been happening again like, a few days ago i got one from human. well, supposedly from human. anyway, viruses suck.
valentine
-

puke, the new viruses people are creating don't need to actually infect a persons computer to use their email address. the virus goes into the infected compuers address book and sends out emails with viruses to everyone in that address book or uses those email addresses to send out emails. i got viruses awhile back from you, dan and human. a theSTART fan must have gotten infected and had all of us in their address book and then it sent out emails from all of us. mia got one awhile back supposedly from me too, but I wasn't infected. whats bad is when someone opens the email, infects their computer and the cycle begins again. best thing is to have a virus scanner that catches the viruses. i learned when a virus killed my computer and i had to start over.
maise
-

what the fuck?? somebody who had my old password maybe? i'm confused... if it was a virus it's good you didn't open it. maybe i should change screen names? after eight years i've given this email addy to a million people, anybody could be doing that. sorry, folks. when did you guys get these viruses from "me" and how did it happen exactly?
~compuker~
-

At the back of your closet... Naw, I've been checking in, but I've just been quiet.
Bronagh <bronagh@badgirlsgotohell.org>
-

=P
pfft
-

not trying to be cool, just lazy
maise
-

i too got one from srpukealot, and it was a virus. usually now, i check the file size, cos if it's rather huge, chances are, it's a virus. so i'll just trash it.
v (i wanna be cool too hehe)
-

kt.. might want to check your comp for viruses. i got an email supposedly from puke awhile ago that contained a virus. really what happened was someone that had him in their address book was infected with a virus that used his email addy to spread the virus.
m
-

From : srpukealot To : limpandstutter@hotmail.com Subject : Cbc, cbf Date : Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:02:24 -0500 IF THIS WASN'T YOU THEN WHO THE FUCK WAS IT!?!?!? AAAHH!
kt
-

the matrix has you.... seek the answers www.thematrix.com
mx
-

it wasn't me as far as i know. maybe it was the mothman. somebody was probably pretending to be me and trying to send you one of those dead baby computer viruses or something. what was the email name?
~vomit van gogh~ <srpukealot@aol.com>
-

LURKING!?!? why, where!?
kt
-

I've been LURKING!
Bronagh <bronagh@badgirlsgotohell.org>
-

Bronagh---where the hell have YOU been!? Hey PUKE. i got some kind of email from you that didn't do anything. motherfucker was blank. said 150k with no attachments but goddammit there's nothing there. whatever it is, send it again, unless its some kind of ratbastard computer virus. if its some kind of ratbastard computer virus, i wish a plague of dead babies upon you!
kt <limpandstutter@hotmail.com>
-

Sweet. Now I know what EP and LP stand for, but that leads me to more questions. What does Extended Play and Long Play mean? Does it only deal with vinyl or are tape/CD's associated it too? I know this is probably killing some of you out there, but if you don't know, you don't know. Thanks!
Sean
CS, CO USA -

hey i jus saw u guys for the first time at the hob with afi..... u guys are sooo awesome.. aimee ur my idol!
Pareesa <jacks10_17@yahoo.com>
Yorba Linda, CA US -

try umm anywhere. amazon/cdnow should have it. your average record store usually has at least one copy lying around.
stefanie
illadelphia, -

uh, ok, i dont know who is gonna get this, but i'm just wondering when/where i can get the shakedown cd. thanx
anna <ratgirl22@hotmail.com>
fontana, ca u.s.a -

i forgot to say happy birthday to puke! ah!
punchy
-

The sad thing in this world is that in realising that whenever your life is shit, it means that eventually it has to get better, is that whenever it's going well, it's probably not gonna last either.

had a night off, got stoned. Played pool with bombs and dynamite.
Metal Malcolm
-

Nothing ever seems to go exactly to plan for anybody, Emily (and I reckon it'd be pretty dull if it did), and things always work out in the end. Maybe if you'd have got accepted, you'd have hated the place. Maybe now you'll end up going somewhere you unexpectedly love! - as ever, late on the topic -
Bronagh <bronagh@deaddesire.org>
-

Just stumbled onto this website... These guys (and gal) any good?? I knew Jaime when he was in SNOT & Souls @ Zero. Just want to wish him good luck with this band.
Adam <bungleism@aol.com>
Hoboken , NJ U.S. of MuthaF'n A -

emily, I totaly feel your pain about the school thing and life in general right now. I mean, just looking around at everything going on in the world right now, we live in a pretty fucked up society. And when some one is just trying to make a future for themselves only having to face bullshit like you you dead, only makes life all that more difficult. I'm 22, working a full time job and going to school part time. NY state is going to be raising the tuition fee for college by about 41%. I'm having enough trouble affording to live as it is now. i don't know if I can afford to go back to school now, and I'll probobly be stuck working the same shit job for another 20 years. But I just try to keep work at work and all my problems in the back of my mind and focus on the positive. But I admit, some days i'll read the news paper or have a shitty day at work and loose focus, but i'll go home and throw on a clash album or look forward to a show the coming weekend i'll be playing with my band. So just keep your chin up cuz' I think things can anly hopefully get better.
greggy <gfeller@warwick.net>
Middletown, ny -

Thank you for all the encouragment!!!I am crying from all the words that you guys said. I am truly touched by the people I hardly even know personally. Thank you. :-) so much love in the air... I am learning...don't worry about me. see you guys in feb when our band plays! :-) love
Emily
-

EP means Extended Play. LP means long play.
AM
AZ USA -

Random question...What does EP mean? I know it's a record/vinyl but what does it stand for?
Sean
CS, CO -

oklahoma wants to have theSTART's babies. no, i swear, i put my ear to the RED DIRT, and it told me that.
monica
OK! -

oh okay! well even though i don't know puke, HAPPY BIRTHDAY... hope it was good
Cruella
-

An incredibly late happy birthday puke.

And I never knew you worked for line6. Lucky man. Any chance of sending one of those big yellow delay units my way? I could be rich and famous one day......perhaps......
Metal Malcolm
-

Happy Birthday puke.
valentine
-

happy birthday you son of a bitch. are you old enough to buy me booze, yet?
kt
-

HAPPY BIRTHDAY PUKE!
M
-

happy belated birthday puke.
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

20 Dead Flower Children will be reuniting for a one off memorial show for their fallen friend Chris "Chin Strap" Gianella, the show will take place at the House Of Blues in Anaheim, CA on January 30th and will feature the following bands:
Bullets N' Octane
Droid
The Bronx
Six
Ex-Idols
Death On Wednesday
Humanlab
Lit
Corporate Avenger
20 Dead Flower Children
Zebrahead
(hed)p.e.
All proceeds from the show will be donated to The Gianella family.
theprp.com
-

happy birthday puke... i'm going to san diego next weekend and i am highly unimpressed that i will be that much closer and yet that far from seeing theSTART again. ah well. as for college, being rejected is hardly the end of the line. it's possible to go to a school that suits you fine for a year, take general eds that you'd have to take in your school of choice anyway, kick ass gradewise and then transfer...? who knows. there are always options.
stefanie
-

school isn't worth ending your life. in fact, in some ways, school can help end your life without you even trying to do it yourself. not to mention that, after earning all your credits and becoming the most erudite person to ever stomach that many classes and bullshit profs, you could get hit by a bus walking across the street and it would all come to an abrupt and very ironic end. such is life, i'm afraid. and if you didn't get in and you never do then you're not supposed to and you shouldn't jump to deadly conclusions. i went to college (jr) for maybe a week. i was convinced that everyone who ever told me that i'd be a nameless pile of shit without that piece of paper that says "way to go, you graduated college" was right and i was going to do it just to be an official smart ass. i've also come very close to ending my own life. neither worked out. i couldn't afford my school books and the time i had to take from work to go to class left me with tiny paychecks and no gas to get either place on time. instead i decided to foccus on what i already knew about music and the business and just read up on it a little more. i took what i already learned about guitars and amps and the repair and maintenance of such things (something that isn't taught in any college that i'm aware of) and put it to good use. had school worked out well for me i'd still be there. had i killed myself in high school i'd be gone. instead i've seen and done some of the most amazing things that one person could ever hope to experience in one lifetime. i have a kick ass job at line 6 making guitars for a living and have people twice my age in my supervision. if i was in school right now i might as well be dead. but that's just me. this could all be over tomorrow, but for now you have the power to make decisions that will map out your life for the better or worse. the short and the long term. be bold and mighty forces will come to your aid.
p.s. it was my barfday wednesday. say good-bye, brain cells. hello gray matter.
~univomitsity~
-

New York misses theSTART. aimeeeeee did you like those pics? i hope ya did. i should be the official start photographer. all for free of course. :o)
natalie
ny -

Hey theSTART! I know So Cal is lovely this time of year but get out there and start touring! We need you to warm us up here in Colorado! Best of luck...
Sean
Colorado Springs, CO -

Hey theSTART! I know So Cal is lovely this time of year but get out there and start touring! We need you to warm us up here to Colorado! Best of luck...
Sean
Colorado Springs, CO -

Hey rad site! I heard your songs and I really dig your sound. I'm going to head down to your show at the Glasshouse. I wanna check out your sound live and in person. Also, anyone out there, if you have a few minutes to kill.. head over to www.gotbaggage.com Baggage is one of my favorite local bands and I am a true believer is supporting your local bands. Keep on rockin' The Start! *support your local bands*
Marisa <cherry_red@smurfs.com>
La Puente, CA USA -

what school is it? i wasnt able to attend the one i wanted either, money reasons, but there are tons of schools out there. maybe take a year off and re-apply. you might even be able to attend a junior college for 2 years and transfer in as a junior at the school you want. there are plenty of options and killing yourself is never the answer to any decision.
maise
-

emily don't you dare... if you kill yourself I'll kill you!0 Imagine what would have happened if I gave up every time we had a setback... the show at the HB pier starts at 3:45... it simply says it is at the HB pier that would mean Main ST. and Pacific Coast Hwy... I do not know what time exactly we will play... I will let you know when I do aecho
echo
-

I just got my rejection letter from the college I really really wanted to attend. sooooooooo depressing life is exactly what you not expected to be. I am going to go kill myself now and have a wonderful after life. I hate this world, this society, and my stupid dream. emily
Emily
-

Where exactly are we suppose to go for the huntington pier tour???? I am soooo confused. Assume that I don't live there!!!
emily
-

Hey
Terri <fr_ee_k@hotmail.com>
UK -

Sorry for the last speak out i was in a hurry,working.I hope you guys understand it.i meant huntington beach pier.oh yeah i was one of your old fan from HWP.
nick
los angeles, ca -

for your free show on huntigton pier, can you put the time you guys are playing,Thanx.oh yeah i meat you guys at la last time i the guy with the dog in ground zero,USC.I'll see you guys at the troubadour.
nick
los angeles, ca -

hope to see everyone tonight!
richard <xxdeathsdoorxx@aol.com>
whittier, -

horray for a new tour in the works. i think the start should tour with johnny cash. think about it. its johnny cash.
steFanie
chicago, -

It's amy's (from Oz) Birthday today!!!!! Happy Birthday!!! come out, come out where ever you are....
lauRRRa <circles@ispdr.net.au>
Oz -

uhhh
jibberish
-

Heh, I just turned the UK purple.
Metal Malcolm
-

i came across this thing.. Globaldust... where you can find out where all the fans are for a band. i signed theStart up and here's the link. http://www.globaldust.com/cgi-bin/info.pl?id=15451 go there and enter your info so we can see how many theSTART fans there are out there and where we all are. <3 maise
maise
-

let it go.
you can do it
-

ah that's cool. yeah i hadn't bothered with them in ages. i never got to see hwp :( good for you though :)
Cruella
-

They claim the band has just reached the end of the line, which is fair, as the last two albums weren't great.

Note of interest. First time I saw pitchshifter was opening the 1998 ozzfest at milton keynes. later on on the same stage I saw HWP for the only time. Weird huh?
Metal Malcolm
-

Yes. Scott + Aimee went from HWP to theSTART, but scott is no longer with the band.
?
-

the AZ show is sold out already. poo poo!
shit on me
-

and a little more history if you didn't know (and if I'm wrong on anything, everyone, feel free to correct me.) theStart contain half of what was HWP, Scott and Aimee. Mike went off to Powerman 5000 and Jeff went to Professional Murder Music.
Cory
-

Human Waste Project broke up and Hero IS theStart.
Cory
Ft. Worth, TX -

what happened to human waste project and hero?
Frank <6_sic_6@evil.co.uk>
norway -

ah how come they splitting?
Cruella
-

My first music writing was a fanzine I did. It had an interview with JS, and an article on theSTART. The next thing I did was an interview with Aimee. I'm now music editor of the uni magazine. Pitchshifter meant a lot.

Like I said. Bummer.
Metal Malcolm
-

got to be your CIVILIZED SOCIETYYYYYYYYYYYY
kt
-

oh no! i saw them open for the tones on my 15th birthday. they were great. what a bummer.
kt
-

For anyone who may be interested, Pitchshifter have confirmed the next uk tour is to be their last.
One of the first bands I got into.

Bummer.
Metal Malcolm
-

I was told that Kelly Osbourne was playing on some TV show yesterday evening (some thing with Ant & Dec, for those of you in the UK TV know), and her drummer had a theSTART shirt on. Ok, so it's Kelly Osbourne, but good publicity nonetheless...
Bronagh <bronagh@badgirlsgotohell.org>
-

i luv theSTART. i just wanted to thank them for doing whut they do. you guys are GOD. im glad yer playing back in CALifornia. i kan see you again. yer so beautiful live. keep writing shit. *it makes my life OK*
Soda <murdercitydiablo@yahoo.com>
costa mesa, CA the sick U.S. -

The start are a good band. I hope to be seeing them live sometime soon!
Celeste <CNC8220@aol.com>
-

Well thats cool theStart will be playn with Tsunami Bomb, i havent seen them in a while.. Its almost time for the Warped tour.. AFI is all over it this year!! Well be nice to eachother kids,, peace, Spiders&Stars
Angela C <onestaralone@yahoo.com>
-

howzit guys....we really love suporting our companions abourd.. but realy if you have the time and cash.it would be lovely if you could come and do a tour.. you guys know our best fuzi-gish they rock.well punk on and f the goverment!!!! they only try to rule us cheers
johan <acid@absamail.co.za>
Pretoria, gauteng South Africa -

howzit guys....we real
johan <acid@absamail.co.za>
Pretoria, gauteng South Africa -

nothing. just poor texas kids who don't know what winter is. i read calvin and hobbes voraciously as a small child, and i found i could join in with calvin in all the fun shit---except when it came to all the really cool winter calvin and hobbes cartoons. he had so much goddamn fun on a sled, and snowmen were a bottomless abyss of material from which to go on. but not little kt, nope. all he could do was look out the window in january at the swampy, wet ugliness outside and sigh. *sniffle* goddammit
kt
-

so what's this about???
Lucy Sanchez <WickedBeck@aol.com>
Los Angeles, CA U.S.A -

we should lobby our mayor, savalily. I dunno how long youve been in austin but apparently, by some ungodly miracle it snowed over a foot in central texas over a one week or so span in the winter of '84
kt
-

damn, ive just realized that ive never seen snow either. i feel so deprived. ive seen the START though. and thats got to be better than being cold and wet... well at least, better than being cold.
savalily <sava@inorbit.com>
austin, tx -

somebody's gotta ask robert mann for me if he ever got the egg stains off of his turquoise '57 chevy bel air!
kt
-

tweedy's gotta polyp? what? weird. those tweedy's, i swear. there were like thirty tweedys when i was in school with those guys. the tweedy clan is vast. look out for the tweedys, yall. polyps be damned.
kt
-

Thanks for the info Omar. I haven't been to the beach in years. So I'm assuming this show is free?
ellen
costa mesa, ca -

ANYWAYS!
i hate it when my dinner falls. especially when i'm Hungary.
oh yeah, recover. you remember them, right? they had that one popular song that had a verse that sounded a lot like the first single off the second bangles cd. the bass player has a polyp and they said the huntington show will be their last ever.
~conpukesing~
-

oh my god is theStart touring with fucking RECOVER!?!? AAAAHH!! I remember the good old days when they were called Colorcast. Those fucking straight edgers. at McCallum High School, the two rival bands for a short period was their band and our cliques' band: Bloated Goat. obviously one of the two never made it all the way out of high school.
kt
-

i would enjoy a tape.
punchy
-

being that it will be an outside event... i'll film it and if anyone body wants a copy they can mail me a tape and i'll bump it back. i hope your not pulling my leg about this show on the pier, man!
look above <same as above>
-

about the huntington beach pier thingy. theres a stage to the right of the pier alot of bands play at. i bet you a buck that it will be there. there isn't much room on the actual pier to play... i mean that damn dinner at the end keeps falling off... i doubt the band would want to rock the boat on that thing. hell, i fear going down there sometimes.
Omar A. Morales <FashionVictum@hotmail.com>
Westminster, CA USA -

Mr your on FIRE Mr!
kt
-

can we make pancakes and waffles instead? and maybe play 'catch the lit firecracker' for a while? is that cool at your house, stefanie? thats my favoritest game in world
kt
-

kt, if you want an assignment you can surely come over and shovel my snow. the novelty is wearing off awfully fast; i am so fucking sick of winter already it's unbelievable. bastard ice. also why is nobody good touring? HINT.
stefanie
-

goddammit. i want an assignment, too. its so BORING over here right now. boring, wet and cold. there are two seasons in my el nino tormented state, and those are summer and fall. ive never seen snow before. once or twice a january the roads freeze in the hill country but other than that we see no such thing.
kt
-

hey does any1 know were 2 get sum "the start" r "human waste project" tabs 4 my guitar?????? plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz help im outta ma mind!!!!!! i need them!!!! wen i can play then then ill b so happy
danni <danni_is_sexy@hotmail.com>
uk -

LA/SoCAL street team please check in... email theSTART@thestart.org put "I am IN" in the subject line we have an assignment! thanks for your devotion....
echo <thestart@thestart.org>
-

Hey thanks!!!!
ellen
-

Hey just checked Pollstar and they have listed a show for the START at the Huntington Beach Pier on Sat. 2/8 Don't know exactly where it will be at also don't know if anyone else has heard of it yet thought I pass it along. Jazz
Jazzbuffy
whittier, CA USA -

for sure ellen!!
-erika
-

hm/
punchy
-

LOL yeah puke *snaps fingers back and forth and gyrates neck* you better recognize, fool.
kt
-

SHIT the s5th AFI show is sold fucking out. now i don't want thestart to open, I don't have tickets :(
andrew
USA -

ANYWAYS! Mo did not fire her entire band. Brian and Bill left the band to persue their new "emo" band summerville. Evan the drummer from save ferris is still in her new band which is not titled SAVE FERRIS. Eric also has another new band. they wanted to go on with their other bands while mo wanted to keep save ferris going for the fans. i think you better get yo facts straight before shooting off your mouth.
Angela
-

ANYWAYS! Mo did not fire her entire band. Brian and Bill left the band to persue their new
Ang
USA -

Sex. Drugs. Rock n roll. (Can you feel the drama?)
megziE
-

salvia, the plant. got it.
~pukeslexic~
-

robert smith is the patron saint of pms. nobody else will ever come close.
according to pollstar the band have one afi show on the 23. i had heard they were doing the 25 show but since then there's been nothing. pollstar also confirms both the troubadour and glasshouse shows. and, since i've seen no mention of it anywhere, i'm assuming that theStart/save ferris tour is not a go. that's right, you read it correctly. you remember save ferris, right? they're that ska band with the one popular song which was a cover of dexy's midnight runners only popular song? for a little while there it seemed that both bands were going on the road together for a tour that i had affectionately come to reffer to as "the poor man's garbage/no doubt tour." the story goes that the singer from save ferris fired her entire band (sans herself for some reason) and formed an emo band but kept the same name. their webite is down and the band have done nothing since early last year sometime. so i guess the tour won't happen. we can all let out a sigh of relief.

kt, who's saliva was it, owsley's? how much of a street value does my spit have?
~puke on eileen~
-

hey people check out an awesome band by the name of scarling. @ scarling.net. scarling. features jessicka from jack off jill on vocals. i don't know if any of you remember, but over the summer they toured the west coast alongside theSTART. *** scarling. cite influence from the cure, my bloody valentine, babes in toyland, daisy chainsaw, radiohead, any many many others. they've been described as, "babes in toyland meets sigur ros in robert smith's garage," "dark pop noise, or just plain good fun," and "the cure with bigger distortion pedals and a violent case of PMS." *** they have mp3 samples up on the site under the section titled "band aid covers the bullet hole." they also have a kick ass message board (with tons of other theSTART fans) under the section "watch us watch you, use our names in vain/vein." *** if you're into theSTART, queen adreena, placebo, or any of the bands mentioned before, definitely check them out. they're worth it.
pretty like drugs <xscaredofgirlsx@yahoo.com>
Cincinnati, OH USA -

http://www.nion.us/
stefanie
philly, -

hey everyone. i dont remember if i've posted since jan 1 2003, but if not happy new year everyone. so i got a new scanner. and i put up a few (not all) pics from October 2001. here is my personal favorite. it was from the show on Long Island, NY (like i said 2001). if anyone wants to see more drop me a line. or if someone wants to use it on their echo/theSTART sites just lemme know.
xoxo
natalie <nirvanavcv@aol.com>
ny -

HI ERIKA. See you at the troubadour show???
ellen
-

Malcolm- I did recieve your package. Thanks a bunch! I sent you one back, with all these stickers and junk, and crap...damn I wonder if that package(one I sent) is in another lil boys hands...he will be corrupted I swear. Mail me, I lost your addy. Hope to hear from you soon...and I have a lot to tell you and ask about. Hugs and kisses HI ELLEN!!!!
-erika <morbidhalo5@aol.com>
-

yeah, thats what i said. except in eight thousand syllables across eons of evolutionary development over chasmic transdimensional swirls of otherwise hindered lingual function and complete loss of all motor control.
kt
-

crikey.
stefanie
philadelphia, -

ok here's the deal folks. you all know that kid or group of kids who think they're all into drugs, do a lot of drugs, know everything about drugs, maybe sell drugs but always buy drugs. they can always top your wildest acid story. they can always dwarf your lowest drunk. they smoke more pot of more purported varieties than you've ever heard of. well, my friends, i was one of those kids. until last weekend that is, from 11:37 to about 11:42 or so in the PM. until salvia divinorum. research is is continuing. further details from ongoing expeditions and a full makeup of physical and psychological fore and after effects are forthcoming. it's the middle-bit, when you actually LEAVE THIS UNIVERSE that's the tricky part to pin down. there is no tether.
kt
-

malcolm - americans in general, or kt in particular? ;)
kenickie
-

Me? I'm a sweet innocent pure little boy who's never smoked anything in his life......
No, I haven't smoked pure salvia extract, which is why i'm asking you to supply me with details.
Honestly, americans, I ask you.....

*starts running away*
Metal Malcolm
-

hehehe, i know that i was just saying... i not that dumb :)
cruella
-

i'm not talking about weed, cruella.
kt
-

Is it true that theSTART is opening up for tsunami bomb? i heard a rumour. anyone know if its true?
Ango
-

i don't smoke anything! well weed makes me feel sick so i've never bothered with anyhting :p
cruella
-

has anyone?
kt
-

have you ever smoked pure salvia extract Malcolm?
kt
-

Hello... anyone know where i can get phone logos for theSTART....i remember at the birmingham show a guy had one...it would be very nice for me to have one too....help!
Cruella <poor_pink_flower@hotmail.com>
UK -

KT - Not that I would wish to encourage drug use, but DETAILS DAMMIT! DETAILS!
Metal Malcolm
-

AHHH. THANK YOU RICHARD. That so made my day. I can't wait to see you, and the best band live. :) :)
ellen
costa mesa, ca -

hey theSTART is playing at the troubadour on feb 15th. go to troubadour .com..im excited. see u all there.
richard h <xxdeathsdoor@aol.com>
whittier, -

AFI needs an opening band in Phoenix, theSTART should do it. PPPLLLEEEAAASSSEEE!!!!! Jan. 25th!!!!!!
Andrew <guszmiller@cox.net>
ARIZONA, AZ USA -

TheSTART and Tsunami Bomb? That sounds fantastic. Only if you come play in TEXAS. I am starting to have violent withdrawls.... I neeeeeeed it, Sid.
megziE
-

Ok so there is five bids for the one which was $1 but there is also one further down the page (if you search The Start) for $2.50 which has no other bids at the mo.
raepepper
UK -

I just saw Shakedown on Ebay for one dollar!!!!!!!!! I think there were two copies flying around. May the best person win.
Raepepper <redhotraepepper@yahoo.co.uk>
London, UK -

24 hours later and i still can't say anything about the experience other than that i did it. i couldnt possibly translate what i saw for roughly 5 minutes into words.
kt
-

i smoked salvia extract for the first time tonight.
kt
-

Hey all, once again, sadly, long time no see! Just wanted to say how estatic I was today when my start stuff came in the mail! yay for deliveries! In true start fashion, it made my suckyass day oh so happy :) ~The One and Only
Jacob
-

Thanks for playing here in scotland... and thanks to those few girls and boys who made me looks less of a fool for going nuts and dancing my ass off by joining in at the Garage MUCH GRATS! also thanks Jeff and Aimee for being normal people! interested in being part of a comic let me know! thanks AkEMi
Akemi <Naberrie@comic.com>
Stirling, Scotland *SOB* -

theSTART and tsunami bomb? my perfect show!!
kenickie
-

Hey guys....I heard thestart is going to open for tsunami bomb at the glasshouse feb. 26th. Is this true? And to all going to the afi show...lucky!! I'll be there in spirit.
ellen
-

Happy new year all, hope your holidays were better than mine.
Hyp - I'm sorry to hear that. Hope you're ok. You still have my email if you need to talk right? Look after yourself.
KT - OKAY! I know, i've only just got back home. Expact mail in the next couple of days.
Erika - Did that package I sent ever arrive? I mailed it in the summer, and If it never got there, i'm gonna be seriously pissed off.
Oh, and COME BACK AND TOUR THE UK AGAIN!!!!

And let my band support........
Metal Malcolm
-

So I recived this stencil from A.F.I. the other day... I'm supposed to hit anything I can with this thing and promote the new record...and i am, don't get me wrong! well, i've got a ticket for this up coming House Of Blues show... I'm planing on making a t-shirt with the stencil make on the back but with the circle start logo on the front. I'm sure I'll get some shit from people at the show for it... who's ganna be there to back me up in case my dancing shoes become shoes'o'protection? I really hope I don't get any shit from A.F.I. fans for doin this. I guess lots of A.F.I. fans are willing to cough up ten bucks for this plastic stencil! Silly how far people will go when it's just as easy to just make one yourself... VIVA LA Legion!!! E-mail me if your going to be in town for this show or if your going to be there to join me in this back A.F.I./Front START shirt. i'm hopping on meeting lots of you to make this shirt possible! we need ye STart fans to show your pride at the A.F.I. show! what i have in mind is to met up a day or so before the show in a plain shirt of some sort... and i'll be there to paint the back with the a.f.i. stencil and then hit up the front with the start logo... what cha say kiddies???
Omar A. Morales <FashionVictum@hotmail.com>
Westminster, CA USA -

I hope everyone brought in the new year with the ones you love and good, clean, typical, American fun. I know I did.
megziE
-

Hey Everyone! This is directed to Human, have you heard about any new tour dates lately? I don't mean for it to sound like I'm whining, but I can't wait to see them in person! If you can, please email me at this email address, b/c my other computer is down. Thanks! _Marissa_
*Marissa* <CountessRaven420@aol.com (for now)>
Greenwood, Louisiana USA -

Hey Everyone, This is directed to Human.. have you heard about any new tour dates? I don't mean to whine, I just can't wait to see them in concert! If you can, email me at CountessRaven420@aol.com, because my other computer is down right now. Thank you! Much Love, Marissa
*Marissa* <PuNkPiXiE696@msn.com>
Greenwood, Louisiana USA -

Well i just wanted to say Happy New Year to everyone!!! i had a great night and brought in the new year pretty rad!! one thing that kinda sux is i cant get tix to the show with AFI, u never know i might be there!! hehehehe its all good.. take care everyone! Spider&Stars
Angela Carn <onestaralone@yahoo.com>
-

Happy NEW YEARS everybody!!! Hope 2003 a good one for all
The Widow
-

thanks stefanie. the more i learn about lupus the more i want them to find a cure for it.
anyway, happy new year to all. hope it's a good one.
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

happy new years eve! hope everyone stays safe tonight, and heres to another great year for theSTART! ::Raises glass of hot apple cider:: Cheers!
Kelle <kelry99@aol.com>
IL -

a neighbour of mine has lupus; it's pretty scary... hope you're doing ok hypnaughtika. i hope everybody has a safe new years'.
stefanie
philly, -

those of you who can remember stuff and/or care know that i don't believe in the phony new years that i'm currently celebrating. just because i don't believe it doesn't mean i can't enjoy it, so there. but, to those believers out there, may the celebrated beginning of the year 2003 bring you great joy and few headaches the following day. if you decide to venture out onto the government roads make sure you have either a designated driver or a designated jaws of life operator with you at all times.

p.s. pmm are looking for a guitarist. cross your fingers.
~puke year's eve~
-

HAPPY NEW YEAR. Be good tonight, and if you can't be good, be good at it.
Fiona
-

malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm malcolm...
kt <limpandstutter@hotmail.com>
-

well, lupus is a chronic disease that has a ton of symptoms caused by inflammation in one or more parts of the body. it has to do with the immune system. to learn more go to here.
and thanks. i am doing ok but i still don't believe this has happened.
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

http://www.behindthelabel.org/gap/
somebody
-

http://www.behindthelabel.org/gap/
somebody <whatsyourlie666@hotmail.com>
-

what is lupus? i never heard of it before... i sorry bout your friend :( hope you are doing okay...
Cruella
-

i don't want this to sound sad or anything like that. but i lost a good friend to lupus at the beginning of the week. and i want to say if you are into donating to charities/causes then please consider donating to a lupus fund. a cure needs to be found.
thanks.
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

I agree about living in Texas. This site doesn't need any 'faster here new now better'improvements. It's great the way it always has been.
megziE
-

I want snow.
Fiona
-

ick im sick. and it was snowing here tooo. but i didn't go outside because i didn't want to die.
punchy
-

happy holidays to all!
snow - there is a ton here. someone take it away!
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

happy holidays you sea monkeys!
jamie
-

I don't see what it is with people around the holidays, they all come out and act like a bunch of idiots. HUMAN has done, and in my opinion, will always do a fantastic job on theSTART site. No one can replace, or even come close to the kindness that is human. Happy Holidays and much love to all.
valentine
-

i've never seen snow before. not with my own eyes at least. texas is hotter than hell, so that will obviously have to freeze over first before we get any such thing.
kt
-

a donation has been made in your name to the HUMAN fund. money for people. we love you human! know what we hate? SNOW THAT RUINS TRAVEL PLANS YOU FROSTY BASTARD.
stefanie <sms52@drexel.edu>
phillayyyy, -

I didn't quite understand Missy's post. In fact, in that last sentence, "that's gay!" was the only legible part, and THAT didn't make any sense, so I'm guessing the rest doesn't either. Bah humbug, I've eaten too many chocolates. Merry Christmas! x0x0
Bronagh <bronagh@badgirlsgotohell.org>
-

yeah human rocks. and- i dont see what's wrong with slipping theSTART onto some nationally televised shows... even if it is TRL at least someone might see it and wonder what it is. anyway..... merry christmas to everyone who celebrates it. to those who dont, um, have a nice day! :)
TAP <oneireland@yahoo.com>
Mechanicsburg, PA USA -

Merry Christmas everyone! "Santa" aka: my mom, came and brought a bunch of stuff she bought from theSTART store. Whoohoo! And what the hell is up that chick's ass who is trying to replace Human????
Marissa <PuNkPiXiE696@msn.com>
Greenwood (Shreveport), Louisiana US -

merry x-mas to all!!!!!
-erika
-

i agree with punchy. human is indispensable and is an exceptional webmaster. being a webmaster is not a simple task and i think she's been doing a outstanding job. merry christmas! happy belated hanukah! happy new year!
<3maise <maise@blackenedangel.com>
CA -

what's holding you back, punchy?
kt
-

ouch! ~ merry christmas...
human <human@thestart.org>
-

also, your post was not very nice, but i dont want to get into it.
punchy
-

human will never be replaced!
punchy
-

since nobody ever updates this site with pics or really anything except tourdates i think a new webmaster is in order? i love the start but when i read that those kooks in good charlotte were wearing a start shirt on trl well thats some lame shit right there.i would be embarrassed if they were wearing my bands shirt (if i had a band that is) sorry but sometimes that kind of publicity is not good. the start should be a littloe more choosy as to what bands the bro dowm with and have sporting their shirts because that's gay!
missy
-

Yea I agree, the holidays are nothing special for those of us who don't celebrate. I'm not bitter though I quite enjoy not having to stress about showing my love through gifts. Yea I just heard about Joe Strummer today when MTV2 was actually airing quality entertainment ( a multitude of Clash videos and clips of Joe speaking). It's sad and 'the great country of America' is on it's decline morally but hey me and you ( whomever is reading this), we are still alive so cheer up.
megziE
-

Any new tour dates for the south? I'm dying to see theSTART in concert.... Hit me back. Hopefully with good news... Later.
Marissa <PuNkPiXiE696@msn.com>
Greenwood (Shreveport), Louisiana U.S. -

On a lighter note, check out this kickass animation by clicking on my name.
Fiona
-

Former Clash frontman Joe Strummer is dead. He was 50.
Fiona
-

hello my friends. these are dark times. the guillotine blade is on its downstroke. There are times when things get so hairy and intense that you emerge in a most tranquil state of cognition. You see everything for what it really is and what it stands for. You see, in this state of overdriven clarity, the real evil in things, in people. When I was in junior high, they taught us all about the Holocaust. We all read The Diary of Anne Frank. All I could think to do when the teacher got into little Anne�s belief that all people are inherently good was to nurse a particular fantasy. People she thought. Like, all of them. Sorry Anne. I fantasized about going back in time and arming the Frank family. If I could go back in time, I thought when I was about twelve, I would sneak into that goddamn attic and stock those motherfuckers to the brim with Uzi�s, nines, frag grenades and plenty of bullets. That way, they would have been better off. No matter how things went after that, you can bet your bottom dollar. One last slim, but fighting chance would�ve been better than they way they went. i'm tired, i'm bummed and i'm high as a kite. goodnight. sleep tight. dont let the bed bugs munch. LOL
kt
-

click my name for an article you ALL should read about what the us is doing to muslim citizens. verrrry interesting; sound strangely familiar to anybody else? on a lighter note, the holiday season sucks for those of us who don't celebrate xmas. i'm headed up to canada for the rest of the year; season's greetings and all that junk to all of you who deserve it.
stefanie
philly, -

Hey isn't it cute when you can't engage in illegal activities as a result of an anul curfew and you are forced to sit in the next room and surf the net!?! EVERYONE HAVE A GREAT HOLIDAY!!
megziE
-

hey human, i replied to an e-mail you had sent me awhile back that was in response to a post i had made on the board, but the reply address was thestart@thestart.org. it's been awhile and i haven't heard back from you, (sorry if the the lengthy'ness of it made your eyes roll to the back of your head) so i was wondering if you had seen it at all yet? or should i forward it to your human@thestart.org address? or did i throw too much at you at once? i think i'm asking too many questions. shutting up now. yes. hope all my fellow thestart weirdos have a great holiday. <3
mike <trashboyx@yahoo.com>
-

new song to download at the King Monkey website! go have a listen.
kenickie
-

heres something i got in the mail on the fued. Kelly Stokes Osbourne Vs. Corgan Feud Kelly Osbourne stoked hostilities between the Osbourne family and former Smashing Pumpkins frontman Billy Corgan at the New York City area radio show, Claus Fest, in Uniondale, New York on Thursday night (December 12). Corgan and Sharon Osbourne had a tiff several years ago, after she quit as the Pumpkins manager. The feud came alive again at the Almost Acoustic Christmas in Los Angeles on December 7. At that show, Kelly's boyfriend, Bert McCracken of the Used, allegedly tried to trip Corgan, who performed with his new band Zwan. Corgan allegedly struck back by kicking McCracken in the stomach, according to sources at the Los Angeles radio station. Osbourne took verbal revenge in New York, telling the crowd from the stage that Corgan performed oral favors on the program director of the New York radio station to secure a spot on the bill. Sharon Osbourne's relationship with Corgan went sour when she dropped the Pumpkins as a client. The band filed suit against her in early 2000. At the time of the split, Sharon said in a statement: "It was with great pride and enthusiasm that I took on management of the Pumpkins back in October [1999], but unfortunately I must resign due to medical reasons...Billy Corgan was making me sick!!!" As far as the music at the 'Claus Fest, Audioslave made its triumphant return to New York after its recent live set for The Late Show With David Letterman. The festival also featured the New York debut of Corgan's Zwan, Queens Of The Stone Age, Boxcar Racer,Coldplay, Stone Sour, Kelly Osbourne, the Vines, and others. Audioslave, fronted by Chris Cornell sporting blue jeans and a black wifebeater-style shirt, ripped out six songs: "Light My Way," "Set It Off," "Gasoline," "Stone," "Cochise," and "Shadow Of The Sun." Some in the crowd were disappointed with the radio-station-sponsored show due to the fact that Ozzy Osbourne was on the show's bill, but only came out to introduce daughter Kelly, saying they were led to believe Ozzy was performing. There were a noticeableround of boos that greeted Ozzy's daughter, who left after three songs.
Tick Tick <FashionVictum@hotmail.com>
Westminster, CA USA -

I'm so bummed the afi show is sold out. Damn afi fans. lol. I knew it would be. But with my luck I can never get tickets that fast. Ehh. :/ Hopefully there'll be another show soon.
ellen <fiendfemme@hotmail.com>
costa mesa, ca -

to whomever may be interested:
word is out the scarling has some sample mp3's up at their site (scarling.)
natalie
ny -

it's true! it's sooo very very true... who wants to be the god parents?
ticktock <fashionvictum@hotmail.com>
Westminster, CA usa -

ticktock wants to have mr.corgans bitchy bald babies!
valentine
-

i want to put cigarettes out on billy corgans' shiny white scalp.
kt
-

I am looking forward to seeing you at the HOB on the 23rd. of Jan.
erin j peters <erinpeters@cox.nett>
mesa, az 85205 -

get this. at the kroq almost acoustic xmas last weekend the used played right before zwan. zwan is billy corgan and jimmy chamberlin's new band since the smashing pumpkins and the used are friends of theStart. the drummer, branden, wore a start hoodie in their video. so the used are playing their last song and their singer, bert, asks the audience to throw shit at him. he does this pretty frequently and even did it on stage at that radio show in salt lake city that theStart played, causing his girlfriend (kelly osbourne) to vacate the stage or suffer possible injury from the multitude of objects being hurled onto the stage per her boyfriend's request. so billy corgan is pissed because his band is up next and the stage is covered in debris. plus bert's girlfriend kelly has a mother who used to manage the pumpkins but "quit due to medical problems, billy corgan made me sick!" she said. so then supposedly while bert was walking off stage he tried to trip billy. then billy turns around and kicks bert in the fucking guts!! so there's obviously lawsuits in the works. it surprised me that billy corgan, who once tried to single-handedly put an end to moshing, would be so violent as to kick a guy who's half his age in the stomach. after zwan fails i hear his next attempt at reviving his career will either be gangsta rap or pro wrestling.
~smashing pukekins~
-

thestart should also play irving plaza with a.f.i :)
punchy
-

YAYYY!! I'm def going to this show.
ellen <fiendfemme@hotmail.com>
costa mesa, ca -

A.F.I. has invited theSTART to open Jan.23rd 2003 at the Anaheim House of Blues ... tix go on sale tomorrow 12/13. this show will sell out immediately...
Aecho
-

tonight, theSTART on "an hour underground!" 10-11 pm central time. most the start songs will be played, (probably ALL). www.buedge.com or call 309-677-3456 to request your fave song! thanks for listening!
kelle <kelry99@aol.com>
-

Okay, okay, i'll send you my number goddammit. Just stop with the harrasment........honestly.....kids these days...no patience......
Metal Malcolm
-

MALCOLM YOU MOTHERFUCKER
kt
-

Just out of curiousity, how long wiull an order tak to reach the UK? I'm going home over christmas and I want to know which address to send it to. Oh, and if anyone wants to hear my side project Johnny Castaway's 10 1/2 minute track we recorded for a university CD, catch me online. MSN or email metalmalcolm@hotmail.com
Metal Malcolm <mal@headrushmusic.co.uk>
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you can buy me a hoodie and the new shirt with the heart if you love me :)
punchy
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Glad to hear that Mia. Ok...I'm definetely getting the hoodie now. Does anyone know how long shipment will take? Thanks everyone. :)
ellen <fiendfemme@hotmail.com>
costa mesa, ca -

i'm 5'5 and the large hoodie fits quite well; they look lovely and they're soooooo comfy. plus they zip. and they have your full daily allotment of vitamin c.
stefanie
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i'm good thanks. how have you been? and whoever will be getting those as gifts are pretty lucky =) take care!
valentine
-

Yes...it's me. How are you doing Miss Valentine? Thanks for that tidbit, I'm gonna get the hoodie, 5 tshirts for myself, and tshirts for xmas gifts. I'm glad I can finally buy the new merch.
ellen <fiendfemme@hotmail.com>
costa mesa, ca -

is this the ellen that was at the chain reaction show with the cool "old skool" thestart shirt? if so, the large should fit you okay. it may be kinda fluffy but it should fit fine. I've seen a friend wear the size large and she's tiny and it looked pretty good on her. hope I helped.
valentine
-

Yay...store is back...I'm prob gonna buy most of the shirts, and the hoodie. But there's only large and x-large. I'm 5'5 and fairly skinny, I'm worried about the large being too big. Are you guys gonna have smaller sized hoodies?
ellen <fiendfemme@hotmail.com>
costa mesa, ca -

wow...i haven't posted here in two years...hello.
cfriddle
wv -

TheSTART store is up & running..... NOW! the Hoody...the new EP...the Eno shirt & more...including FREE shipping before Christmas.....and the Shakedown Album t-shirt is ON SALE! Welcome Home theSTART ... (you are theSTART & we can be too!)....
human <human@thestart.org>
-

the online store is back! ... or IS it?
monica
-

hey hey we're the monkees. people say we monkey around.
stefanie
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Forgot to add: www.ocnypunk.com (Best site about the bands/shows/ and the happenings in Orange County, NY) Thanks
greggy <gfeller@warwick.net>
-

Check out the Orange County, NY Punk Rock/ Rock n' Roll: The Anti-socials: www.members.fcc.net/rubbiolo/as-index.html (1977-84 style oi!) The Armedelight rifles: (Political and social punk band influenced by the clash, the jam, TV Smith & The Adverts) - website in progress, email us for info: rubbiolo@fcc.net
greggy <gfeller@warwick.net>
Middletown, NY USA -

yes, i have heard of "buy nothing day" it's part of adbusters.org campaigns. it's cool. check out the corporate american flag on thier site.
Kelle <kelry99@aol.com>
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your my number one baby for gravy.
punchy
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well other than the ramblings here tonight from em and myself.
valentine
-

an eddie izzard transcript for those of you have never heard his craziness.
valentine
-

Christmastime, you know, Jesus, uhhh, born to a big jolly guy in a red jacket. "Ho, ho, ho! Ho, ho, ho, baby Jesus! And what would you like for Christmas?" "Peace on Earth and goodwill towards men." "Well, what about a clockwork train?" "Oh, yes, much better. Forget - forget peace on earth, I don't care. And, you know, the f - the - Christmas, the fir tree, that - the - there's none of them in Nazareth. The partridge in a pear tree song was not sung at the Last Supper. They weren't there going, " 'And a partridge in a pear tree. Fiiive go-old riiings! Dadada...' Come on, loosen up, Judas." "Oh, all right..." " 'On the seventh day of Christma... Judy, come on, Judy, loosen up." "Don't call me Judy, I've told you!" "Ooohoohooh! Can you lend us a fiver, Judy, I'm a bit short." "Ahhh..." "Alright lads, um, Leonardo di Vinci's painting the picture. All right, so everyone get your positions, here we go." He's going, "Jesus, why are you doing the big arms thing?" "Well, I don't know - I just thought I'd do a big arms thing, I don't know." "Well, I'm going to do a big arms thing as well." "Yeah, me too! I'll call that the big arms..." "Look, we can't all do big arms! We'll look like a squadron of Spitfires, for fuck's sake. I'll do big arms and you just look at me and go, 'Ooh, he's doing big arms.' " "All right." "Leonardo, have you got that one? Have you got the painting? All right, now a fun one as well, 'member...ahhahahh..." That partridge in a pear tree song, the - the only bit we like of it is that, "Fiiive go-old riiings!" People go berserk at that point. People come running in from other rooms - "Fiiive go-old riiings!" You know. The rest of it, we don't know. Uhh, abo - above that, it's just, "Twelve monkeys mating, eleven donkeys dancing, ten pigmies farming, nine socks a swimming, uh - fiiive go-old riiings!"
eddie izzard
-

ohh fine, i'll say my line even though you already said it.... "ah, yes, the vegetarian. yes, there we go, Mr. Hitler. there we go...... like a little wine? Thank you very much you nazi shithead" <3 this has been a "we-are-bored-out-of-our-minds-production"
valentine
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his dvd just came out in the states! :) www.eddieizzard.com
m
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you...you stole my line. psh, see if i ever play eddie izzard with you again.
valentine
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whooops.... "Uhh, I asked for the vegetarian"
em
-

"Ah, yes, the vegetarian, yes, there we go, Mr. Hitler. There we go... Like a little wine? Thank you very much...you Nazi shithead."
em
-

well, have the chicken then, please. taste of humans, sir. Would you like a white wine? there you go. thank you very much. thank you for flying church of england, cake or death?
valentine
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so my choices is or death?
emily
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but i wanted to say "well, we're out of cake! Well, we only had three bits and we didn't expect such a rush. so what do you want?!"
valentine
-

you're supposed to say "you said death! you said death!" then i go "but i meant cake" ... eddie izzard ...
emily
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poop on you, you're no fun.
valentine
-

death... no cake.
Emily
-

emily, cake or death?
valentine
-

Just curious, did anyone else here happen to hear about November 29 Buy Nothing Day or participate in it?
megziE
-

NO theSTART FOR YOU!! COME BACK NEXT YEAR!
~the puke nazi~
-

C'mon guys let them rest a bit. hehe.
megziE
-

yah thestart should really come back to los angeles :P
punchy
-

This band is amazing. It's nice to hear a band that doesn't sound like other bands out there, that seem to all sound the same....yet - the band still kicks ass at the same time!!! I love the CD! :-D
Brynn Hardison <KiSsItBeTTeR0110@comcast.net>
Soddy Daisy, TN USA -

ok. strike that s and make that a t. i am so tired and sick and have had one too many pills today. forgive me for a third post.
hyp again
-

woah. the it in that sentence just slipped past my fingers. *insert it after the at*
hyp again
-

thank you laura! good to see you're still around.
thank you puke! i'm just looking at is as i'm finally no longer a "teen".
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
-

feliz cumpleanos, amanda. don't think of it as another year on earth but another year closer to death. i mean that in the most positive way, of course.

"and babies are born in the same buildings where people go to pass away." ~ gavin hayes
~pukevent~ <srpukealot@aol.com>
-

you guys should come back to los angeles
nick
los angeles, ca -

woooooooooo!! Happy Birthday hyp!! :)
lauRa
oz -

oops! listen to my show on www.buedge.com ... can't forget that bit of necessary info! peace.
kelle
-

welcome home, folks! happy birthday! happy post turkey day to all! don't forget to listen to "an hour underground" featuring theSTART's music, tuesday nights, 10-11 pm central time. hope to see you all soon!
kelle <kelry99@ aol.com>
peoria, missing my chicago home, il -

happy birthday to me!
*hands out the cake*
hypnaughtika <hypnaughtika@yahoo.com>
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ok, the plans were to mail them out on Nov 25th. Some issues arose and I will be sending them out as soon as I get the cds burned. This should be the 2nd week of december. Im really sorry for all the delay and confusion and mix ups.
For more info on the cd you can visit http://www.digaponymusic.com
oh yah the cd is called "we are theSTART - a tribute cd" not "reSTART"

valentine
valentine <blueamphetamine@hotmail.com>
-

when are the reSTART cd's gonna be sent out? has anyone got there copy yet?
angela
-

hi.
punchy
-

oooh, kenickie, you broke it. shame on you.
valentine
-

is it broke or did everyone go quiet?
kenickie
-

my band's website is now up! go look!
kenickie
-

i'd love to go back in time with some smallpox vaccine.
kt
-

Happy we stole your land, killed your people, lied about it to the world, then created a holiday based on this lie and tons of false Hallmark nostalgia Day. I'm glad you guys are back in the USA...you don't know how lucky you are boy...back in the USSR... Sorry, i love jumbling Beatles songs and turkey backlashing as well.
megziE
-

hey MALCOLM send me your number again you rat bastard...."You know," Carl says, "200 million years is quite a long time for something to stay relatively the same form. I mean all kinds of trilobites; the Devonian Phacops Rana of New York, the Cambrian Asaphiscus Wheeleri of Utah, the Ordovician Diacalymene of Morroco..." another skeleton in a suit, with a briefcase and megaphone and tape recorder jammed in his mouth, passes by and crackles, "STOP! WAIT! WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU REMEMBERED YOU WERE STILL ALIVE?" this is craziness, Carl, i say. "The Ordovician FLEXYcalymene of Ohio," says Carl Sagan authoritatively, "there's the Cambrian Eurathia Kongii, also found in Utah..." yet another skeleton passes, screaming "DON'T FORGET THE HOLOCAUST YOU'RE STANDING ON!" there is a corpse behind it, dressed like a colonist. he talks to me with a thick english accent as he passes, eyes wide with shock, whispering hoarsely "The Twentieth Person is Scarce Left Alive..." text appears below him like a television subline, reading 'Robert Cushman, British Eyewitness'. ...............happy thanksgiving everybody. enjoy your food.
kt <limpandstutter@hotmail.com>
-

a stiff dick isn't shy... and neither am i... yo.
_enna_ <mrs_pink_eyes@hotmail.com>
vegas, baby, usa! usa! -

So Human, Does this mean we will be able to get all our lovely theStart merch in time for Christmas?....if so.....Shweet!
Cory
Fort Worth, TX -

happy fake turkey day to you too stef. turkey backlash is great. but you know, i feel bad cos the turkeys kill themselves ya know? looking up at the rain and all with their little mouths open and they drown. =D
valentine
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youuu want low fares, greyhound is there, no we're not nuts, from fifteen bucks... for unknown reasons i love that commercial and squeal with glee when it comes on <3 happy thanksgiving to everybody. has anybody else noticed how much more anti-turkey backlash there is this year? craaazy.
stefanie
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" Our fathers were our models for God. If they bailed, what does that tell you about God? You have to be prepared for the possibility that God does not like you. " And what do I say to that? Amen.
valentine
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ahhhh you stole our posts, evil computers. anyway, here's that demo again. click on the name and all that jazz.

guys and girl of the band - good to hear you made it home safe and sound. hope you had a great time, i know we all did.
kenickie
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theSTART are home-Store opening soon!
human
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fasdfas
test <taefads@jklasfd.com>
fjsdka, NY US -

test
test <test@test.com>
NY, NY US -

we're baaaaack...... (sorry if your post got lost.....there was a disturbance in the force)......
human <human@thestart.org.>
LA, CA -

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